Windows App Studio
“A free, online app creation tool that allows you to quickly build Windows and Windows Phone apps to publish, test, and share. Make changes, add content, and toggle between phone and tablet views to watch your app come alive.”
“And if you want to advanced programming features, Windows App Studio generates your source code ready for Visual Studio – a feature no other app-builder tool provides. There is no better day than today, so get started!”
Your move, Embarcadero.
http://appstudio.windows.com/en-us
Your move, Idera.
Why would Embarcadero be afraid of this?
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David Heffernan It is not unreasonable to assume that this may expand in direction of https://dev.windows.com/en-us/bridges
Embarcadero is not ablet to generate real Windows 10 apps yet 🙁
Javier Hernández Yeah 😀 I think so, the desktop compilers just need a lot of improvement and CLANG support too 😀 I would love to use ARC on desktop, nowadays my codes only run on mobile platforms because I don’t like manual memory management. But a big problem in Delphi is the lack of more productive language features: null hosting operator, truth lambda syntax, ternary operator 😀
Javier Hernández You are making not very much sense here. Where do interfaces come into this? I don’t need to do anything with interfaces to use anonymous methods. The fact that the implementation uses interfaces behind the scenes is not, per se, an issue.
So, what point are you trying to make here?
Javier Hernández That C++ lambdas may be faster is, perhaps, a fair criticism, but it’s not what you said before. I’m not aware of evidence to back it up either. Do you have any? I’m also not sure that a C++ lambda can be inlined.
I’m not defending Embarcadero, I’m criticising you. You repeatedly make imprecise and vague statements.
Javier Hernández How could something whose value is not known until runtime be inlined? So in general, only lambda expressions that are known to the compiler can be inlined.
It’s probably fair to say, though, that a good number of valid use cases are amenable to inlining.
Javier Hernández Only if the value of the lambda is known at compile time. Which it very often is not.
Javier Hernández I don’t buy the notion that only a company as large as MS can be successful, and can produce high quality successful software. There are plenty of counter examples. Embarcadero don’t need to compete with everything that MS do. All they need to do is find a niche, and fill it well.
Sheesh – way to go off topic.
Javier Hernández – The next time you have a desire making an off-topic, generic EMBT bashing comment – just don’t, ok?
EMBT will be doing some turf fighting with MS for doing desktop as well as for mobile apps – but it most certainly is not because of the quality of the code generated by the compiler.
IMO, App Studio could become challenge for
AppBuilderAppmethod, especially if MS add further cross platform capabilities for iOS and Android.Lars Fosdal AppBuilder? The Telerik product?
David Heffernan Oops. Brainfart. I meant Appmethod.
Lars Fosdal They look like they are aimed at completely different markets. Windows App Studio appears to be aimed at what might traditionally be thought of as non-programmers.
Javier Hernández If Delphi is so bad – why have you not moved on to the VSCE?
David Heffernan Perhaps – but it also is a kickstart for programmers that want to make the move, but find it a bit daunting to start fiddling with all the knobs in VS.
David Heffernan Lars Fosdal Well, AppBuilder was the original, internal name for Delphi (which was just a code/beta name initially, I think)..? 🙂
Hallvard Vassbotn The IDE main window class is still TAppBuilder!
Lars Fosdal It is highly unlikely that people just fiddling with programming will choose Delphi. Price is just too high.
And at the moment Delphi cannot produce apps for all platforms App Studio or VS can.
If Delphi should fear App Studio then battle is already lost.
Nice!
Dalija Prasnikar I’m not implying that it is a threat to RAD Studio, but those considering the low end Appmethod, may find this an enticing alternative.
Imagine if you could do something similar with Appmethod (or even Delphi). Enter a web site, select from a few app models, hook up to some data source, add some graphics, set some texts – and voila – you get a compiled app – and it’s source code. If nothing else, it is brilliant marketing.
In my opinion, AppMethod aka FireMonkey will not survive on the market. It is too difficult for newbies to start with that framework and the language, since the lack of information and documentation. Also for me as experienced Delphi developer I couldn’t do some more complex stuff in the trial. Not because it is not possible, but I couldn’t figure out how to do (No docu no source code). With some frustration, I finally gave up. I already switched to Android Studio. The idea behind FireMonkey is really great, but the design of that framework feels really bad.
Interesting. I was following a similar app by the same name a few years ago. It was quite good. I wonder if…
Dalija Prasnikar The reverse is also True. App Studio cannot produce apps for all of the platforms Delphi supports. For a simple app dev tools to learn programming, I’d look towards MIT App Inventor, not Microsoft.
Marco Cantù My point was that people that want to produce universal apps for all Windows platforms (and don’t care about other) cannot choose Delphi anyway (at the moment), so in that regard App Studio targets very different audience and as such cannot be perceived as direct Delphi (AppMethod) competitor.
That said, appearance of App Studio cannot have drastic impact on Delphi. Of course, things can change with time.
Lars Fosdal I am not saying that such thing would not be nice to have (one day).
But at the moment there are other priorities. IMHO chasing free tools market for non-developers is not one of them.
Dalija Prasnikar I am not saying it should be chased – merely that it is good marketing.
Horácio Filho I was waiting, waiting, waiting for the new desktop compiler they kept hinting was coming. Finally Allan Bauer said there are no plans for a new desktop compiler. 🙁 Without that there’s no ARC or a lot of potential new features that would be helped by a new compiler and ARC.
Javier Hernández Delphi doesn’t implement lambdas; it implements anonymous functions. And I’ve made my case before that for a language with support for standalone functions, lambdas would have been the far more useful of the two to implement.
Lars Fosdal This isn’t the only product that does what you’re describing either. AppFactory is one option:
http://www.mippin.com/appfactory/
but there are so many more:
http://www.businessnewsdaily.com/4901-best-app-makers-creators.html
EMBT has been obsessed with being the new Visual Studio when they probably should have been looking for the next Turbo Pascal.
Joseph Mitzen Oh nooo, don’t say that, please, no plans for ARC on Windows? That is too bad 🙁 I love the mobile compilers so much but without ARC on desktop platforms is very sad for me.
Joseph Mitzen Where did you see that Allen Bauer said there are no plans for new desktop compilers? Can you point me with this link? Thanks a lot 😀
Allen Bauer Please, is it truth, no plans for ARC on Windows? 🙁 Many thanks 🙂 Sorry for any incovenience.
Horácio Filho https://forums.embarcadero.com/message.jspa?messageID=697202#697202
Joseph Mitzen Thanks for the link 😀 I can see “Delphi Linux64 compiler based on LLVM” it is a very exciting news 😀 o/ But I don’t know whether it will be only server-side or for desktop too.